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Singleton
12-14-2008, 06:52 PM
Some comments about our Christmas season which is upon us worldwide.

1. "Christmas" is derived from Christ's Mass, the old Roman Catholic term referring to what is now known to all Christians (I am a Protestant myself) as "Christmas."

2. Abraham is our in common religious ancestor as Christians, Jews, and Muslims.

3. In our Old Testament Book of Genesis, Abraham's first born won was by the Egyptian house servant Hagar, who birthed Ishmael.

4. In our Old Testament Book of Gensis, Chapter 17, God tells Abraham things about both Ishmael, Abraham's first born son whose Mother was Hagar (whom Sarah told Abraham to have a child by when Sarah thought she was hopelessly barren in her old age). Ch. 17, verses 20,21 read: "And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation. But my covenant will I establish with Isaac (who was born 13 years after Ishmael of Abraham's wife, Sarah) which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year.

5. Abraham was 100 years old when Isaac was born. Sarah was in her 90s.

6. Two critical religious discussions exist down to 2008:

a) Which child did Abraham offer to sacrifice unto God when he thought he needed to make such a sacrafice?

Answer: Genesis, Chapter 22, verses 1, 2: "And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am. And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son (meaning the only son by his wedded wife, Sarah) Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt-offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of." Abraham was preparing to kill Isaac when God spared Isaac, having tested Abraham's faith and dedication to God sufficiently.

7. Hagar was after Isaac's birth sent away because Sarah, Abraham's wife and the mother of Isaac did not want Isaac and Ishmael raised together. This is discussed further in Genesis Chapter 21, verses 17,18: "And God heard the voice of the lad (referring to Ishmael crying as a baby in the desert); and the angel of God called Hagar out of heaven, and said unto her, What aileth thee, Hagar? fear not; for God hath heard the voice of the lad where he is (as a baby crying, under a bush in the desert with Hagar who has left the household of Abraham and Sarah for good). Arise, lift up the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great nation."

8. In the Old Testament book of Isiah, Chapter 9, verses 2-7: "The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light: they that dwell in the land of the shadow of death, upon them hath the light shined. Thou has multiplied the nation, and not increased the job: the job before thee according to the joy in harvest, and as men rejoice when they divide the spoil. For thou has broken the yoke of his burden, and the staff of his shoulder, the rod of his oppressor, and as in the day of Midian. For every battle of the warrior is with confused noise, and garments rolled in blood; but this shall be with burning and fuel of fire. For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mghty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his gosvernment and peace there shall be no end, and upon the throne of David and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts shall perform this."

9. The New Testament books of Matthew and Luke then tell the story of the birth of Christ, the Son of God, of the Virgin Mary, in a simple stable on the road to pay Roman taxes from their home village of Bethlehem. St. Luke, Chapter 1, verses 26-33 and 38 teach us as Christians:
"And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth, To a virgina espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virtgin's name was Mary. And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women. And when she saw him (referring to the angel), she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be. And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast favor with God. And, behold, thou shall conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end."

10. We then have the birth, death by crucification, burial, resurection from the dead and assension into Heaven of Jesus, who by His grace given freely to all mankind offers us all salvation through Him to God the Father, with the promise and hope of life eternal.

I have written a lot, but left a lot out, and will be glad as a practicing Christian to enterian any questions or comments from any of this site's readers.

Merry Christmas to one and all,
George Singleton
USA

Qrratugai
12-14-2008, 11:38 PM
Thank you for sharing that information with us, Singleton.
Although I don't consider this point important at all, I'd like to share with you the answer to the question "which child did Abraham feel the need to sacrifice?" from an Islamic perspective. Muslims believe it was Ishmael (Ismail in Arabic).
Interesting, ain't it?

Merry Christmas! :)

Singleton
12-15-2008, 03:55 AM
Thank you for your input and comments and Merry Christmas to you, too. And we all pray for a better New Year for the world in 2009.

Yes, I knew that Islam teaches and Muslims believe that it was Ishmael vs. Isaac whom Abraham offered to sacrifice.

But my personal view as a Christian is since both sons by two difference women, one by Hagar, who was not Abraham's wife, first born son, Ishmael, then one by Sarah who was Abraham's actual wife some 13 years later, Isaac, is that our Holy Bible states clearly that both were blessed of God, both were to and did begat great peoples and nations, yet this is where the Bible (Old Testament) finds God declaring Isaac's line as "God's chosen people" or today's line of Jewry.

However, with the advent of Christ, himself a Jew of the tradition of Melchisedec (in the Greek) or Melchizekek, the less than physically perfect group of priests, Jesus brings the grace of God and offer of salvation and life eternal to all, not just the Jews, but also to all others, generally referred to as Gentiles. Salvation is soley of God, whose son Jesus is, but God in our view and belief sacrified his only begotten son, literally, to atone for all mankinds sins for all history. The step remaining is under grace, not by works lest any man should boast, is for man to then accept Jesus as the Savior and the son of God, of the Holy Trinity, the third part of which is the Holy Ghost. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost are the three persons of God in our belief.

As historically your Prophet Muhammed was first a member of a primitive Christian church in what is today Saudi Arabia, he, Muhammed, would be viewed as a Gentile in our theology, ie, a non-Jew. The early Christian church Muhammed was first a member of was made up of Christianized Jews, Greeks, and otherwise of Gentiles, some of whom, such as Muhammed, would I think in today's venacular would be viewed today as Arabs, as Hagar, Ishmael's mother, was Egyptian (ie, Arabic).

Your Prophet Muhammed was totally illiterate, could neither read nor write, by your tradition and history. Your celebration of what to me as a former Pakistan foreign resident in the 1960s is Little Eid, your Prophet's birthday, is to you if I am correct less important than "Big Eid" my terminology, which you celebrate as the completion of your Holy Quaran.

While Jesus could read and write, and taught in the old style Jewish Temple starting in what we view as his teenage years, our Holy Bible was written by our belief and tradition by various Old Testament prophets, and in the case of the New Testament, by various named disciples of Jesus.

We Christains believe that the first book of the Old Testament (Torah to the Jews today) is a divine revelation, written by Moses and authenticated by the testimony of history, and by the testimony of Christ during his mortal lifetime.

Your views are much appreciated and I hope others will feel comfortable in offering their understanding and teachings of Islam as they review both my and now your remarks, as well as my updated thanks to you for commenting. As I believe I am still the only non-Muslim on this site, of course I am inviting comments from the Muslim subscribers of and on this site.

aimal khan
12-18-2008, 02:19 AM
first happy chrstmas and happy new year
i that day participation in the decoration of the chirtmas tree with friends
i consider muhamamd as unlettered not illiterate, and his being unlettered is taken by muslims as a positive point, as he could not write and read, then he did not write Quran AND THUS ITS A DIVINE REVELATION not written by Muhammad. second i like the personality of muhamamd as a complete man, a leader, a governor, a business man, a treaty negotiater, a international relations expert, a war expert, a strategist, a management guru, a city disigner, founder of a state , etc etc , all these we dont find in jesus, he was died/disppeared in 32 years age, nothing is known of his life , he was just a carpenter and a poor man, so called son of God and was crucified and few other events of his life,and few miracles nothing esle to learn except the gospels which is according to muslims not available now in true shape